Jean Bedetti (BSO principal cello, 1919-1948) oral history interview: Bedetti, Madeleine, interviewee (Side A); Phillip Kaplan (BSO 2nd flute, 1939-1971) oral history interview: Kaplan, Phillip, inteviewee (Side B), 1994-09-12T00:00:00+00:00, 2023-08-02T00:00:00+00:00

Cassette 62: Oral history conducted by Robert Ripley on September 12, 1994 (Side A); Oral history conducted by Robert Ripley on September 12, 1994 (Side B); See also VHS 3 for audio recording of these interviews.

PARTIAL TRANSCRIPT

Tape 62, Side A

Interviewer: Bob Ripley Interviewee: Madeleine Bedetti Subject: Jean Bedetti Date: September 12, 1994 Location: Miami Beach, FL

0:25 INTERVIEW BEGINS

1:00-3:05 early life, born in Lyons, France in 1883; came from a musical family, father was principal cellist in Lyons; studied with father then moved to Conservatoire; studied with Jude LOEV; attended Conservatory for 2-3 years, graduated with first prize; was part of the Concert Cologne after graduation

3:05-3:37 personal life, met Jean through her brother; married when she was 17;

3:37-5:25 played 6-8 years in Cologne before coming to the United States; MONTEUX invited him to Boston; was brought on as first cello right away as SHROEDER left

5:25-6:40 impressions of KOUSSEVITZKY: liked him as a man and as a musician; Jean played many solos with the BSO, and recorded some

6:40-7:39 had many private pupils; did chamber music, and solo recitals; performed with BURGIN and SAN ROMA

7:39-9:44 came to Florida between seasons; traveled to France for the first five years; memories of Jean and Madeleine learning to drive;

9:44-10:09 memories of Tanglewood; rented different places every year; positive memories of Tanglewood

10:44-13:13 story of conflict between BEDETTI and KOUSSEVITZKY over a solo performance; BEDETTI was out for two weeks after this, but soon returned

13:13-14:00 after retirement, moved to Miami Beach; did not play much anymore, but did visit Boston

14:00-15:38 Madeleine attended concerts every week; discussion of the history of the orchestra and its conductors since BEDETTI's time

15:43-17:44 personal reflections on Jean: excitable man, energetic; had a strong marriage for 53 years

18:09-18:54 did not do service during World War I because he was an artist

19:30-23:48 memories of Jean; story of MUNCH coming over for a meal; entertained BURGIN and others at home in Florida; she made extra dinner every night, since she did not know which of his students would be in attendance

[23:48-36:32 **The following section is no longer in interview format, casual conversation over a meal**; discussion of Madeleine's dog; 27:19-29:00 memories of the end of Jean's life and reflections on their marriage, on Madeleine's driving and caretaking; conversation about Madeleine's friends and doctors; memories of Jean as a "Christmas baby", born on Christmas; 31:35-34:00 selling Jean's cello; memories of attending Madame VOISIN's restaurant, continued friendship;

36:32 INTERVIEW ENDS

Tape 62, Side B

Interviewer: Bob Ripley Interviewee: Phil Kaplan Date: September 12, 1994 Location: Miami, Florida

0:12 INTERVIEW BEGINS

0:32-2:20 early life, born in Boston; from an amaateur musical family; picked up the flute immediately; studied with LAURENT at New England Conservatory of Music starting in high school

2:20-4:14 did not graduate Conservatory, went to the National Orchestral organization in New York; then played with WPA orchestras in Boston, including one with violinist THITTE; played with the opera orchestra

4:14-5:30 heard of vacancy because he had played with BSO as a substitute a few times; auditioned for KOUSSEVITZKY in his hotel

5:40-18:35 memory of playing Brahms first causing a conflict between horn player and KOUSSEVITZKY; memory of conflict between BEDETTI and KOUSSEVITZKY; felt KOUSSEVITZKY was the "greatest musical director", was a champion of new music and SEBALIUS, created Berkshire festival; story of KOUSSEVITZKY and the bass players; conflict between Larry WHITE and KOUSSEVITZKY; story of KOUSSEVITZKY guest conducting after the union was formed; story of being engaged to play concert at Town Hall one night, summoned to speak with KOUSSEVITZKY, was told he needed to ask permission in the future; loved clothes, memory of Kousse at the Berkshires in a special suit

18:35-19:31 impressions of Tanglewood's creation, experience without work after Pops season ended

19:31-20:43 taught at Boston University; had a trio with BATI and MAYES who performed in and out of Boston; played the Pops and Esplanade

20:43-24:30 memories of Arthur FIEDLER; liked his programs more than WILLIAMS' programs; during Pops rehearsals, orchestra members were not disciplined;

24:30-26:19 played with BIGGS (organist) on radio programs

26:19-27:53 international tours with the BSO; went to Europe and Asia; memories of trip to Germany and London where there were food shortages soon after the war

28:10-28:40 memories of MUNCH, felt he did not apply himself; some concerts were very "high" and some "low"; talented conductor and good person

28:40-29:38 memories of LEINSDORF; was the most prepared of any of the conductors, but did not have the talent; was an excellent guest conductor

30:04-31:02 spoke up in meetings, but was not part of Players Committee; positive memories of CABOT as president of the board

31:02-34:12 family life; met wife in Boston, lived in South End; wife makes handmade rugs

34:12-38:19 after retirement, remained in Boston for some time; did some substitute playing; taught at Boston University; traveled during summer time; finally moved to Florida and still did not stop playing

38:19-41:03 discussion of women musicians; women's pensions in the orchestra

43:50 INTERVIEW CONCLUDES